My wife and I were going to have some friends over so we picked up some snacks and a case of beer. When it was time to pay, the cashier asked to see not only my ID but also my wife’s ID. This was puzzling; it had not happened before in places where we had lived before.
At first I thought that it would a new “progressive” store policy, but something didn’t feel quite right. Thus, we decided to ask the cashier about it.
It turns out, we were told, that New York state law requires that everyone who is at the checkout lane be 21 or older. We were told that the state policy mandates that people cannot be sold alcoholic beverages if they’re with minors, apparently even their family!
The cashier also informed us that in the past there had been many reports of adults giving alcohol to underage kids and thus this law was necessary to prevent such things.
What would happen if an adult and a minor were asked to show ID and upon this happening the minor would go to the car and wait? Again, the cashier mentioned that though they determine these things on a case-by-case basis, the store employees are liable for “illegal” sales and so they do it because their freedom is at stake. Further questioning proved useless, as the employee herself was frustrated and confused about the very law she was required to follow.
I find it hard to believe that this law, putting aside property rights issues, reduces underage drinking. Nothing stops anyone from later on giving the drinks to other people once they leave the store.
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Thank God for fake IDs.
Most, if not all, of the state laws prohibit the sale of alcohol to persons under 21, but usually say nothing about checking IDs…
My 60-year-old father is often irritated when asked for ID before being served, and the server will respond that it is the law to check ID… he usually says that it is not, in fact, the law to check IDs. It is against the to serve underage, and he clearly isn’t. Who are you gonna believe anyway, a piece of plastic or your own eyes?
Conversely, I presume that if a server/clerk is presented with a fake ID and consummates the sale, he/she is in violation of the law. Has anyone ever been convicted under such circumstances?
The issue was not about the 21 and under rule, but rather the one that requires everyone who is part of the group that buys the alcohol to show ID. That part is new to me. In other places (that I know of), only the person buying the beer has to show ID/be 21, and not whoever else might be there with him.
In Oklahoma they will card anyone who comes into the store with you. Very bizarre and stupid.
This just has the feel of underworked bureaucrats with a paycheck to justify. There are already so many laws regulating sales and purchase, to whom, when, how, and to some degree what, that there is very little left to fill in.
When my uncle was a child he be sent by his parents with a large container down to the brewery and fill it with suds for family dinners. My question is, what changed first: the law or morality?
I’m glad to see that the Mises Institute is getting interested in preventing underage drinking. You make a good case that the law is not enough to make a reduction. Probably the best solution to enforce the ban is to legally enforce the implantation of alcohol detectors into the throats of all minors. These could then automatically report infractions to the local law enforcement. I shall get on to my congressman at once!
With the proliferation of RFID tags, all the government trackers will have to do is detect an alcoholic beverage in close proximity with a minor (since we will all have RFID implants, for our safety.)
Perhaps the draconian laws that ban underage drinking foster irresponsible drinking!
I’m only 25 myself, but I was allowed to have a few beers in the house when my parents were around at a teenager. It introduces teenagers to drinking (which is part of Western culture) in a safe enviornment. Much better than getting drunk at the park with friends…
Texas had a law until recently (revoked unfornunately) that allowed minors to drink as long as they were with their parents. It was a pretty good law that gave parents the choice on how to teach their kids about alcohol.
You guys got ahead of me. I was thinking about being part of a database keeping track of my potato chip consumption.
So now you have a situation where a parent, in order to comply with this idiotic law, will probably be forced to leave their child in the car in order to get alcohol. This can easily open the child up to do harm to themselves, be molested or even kidnapped while the parent is in the store. What a brilliant move by law enforcement!
It also puts people in the situation where you can not be convicted of a crime but a potential crime. The fact that you have an underage person with you and are refused alcohol means that the state is accusing you of having the potential to break the law without having the proof of the act. That is insane.
Of course maybe if people just stopped drinking their problems would be solved there but that is another argument for another day
DavidB: “Of course maybe if people just stopped drinking their problems would be solved there but that is another argument for another day.”
Now, now, that’s just crazy talk.
I remember buying beer with my Dad when I was in my 20′s. We were obviously together, but he paid for his first and didn’t get carded. When she asked for my ID, I responded, “if I was underage, wouldn’t I just have had him pay for my beer?
Minnesota has that law too. Highly irritating.
And yet, a ray of light still shines in Wisconsin, where we of course love to drink. I became a licensed bartender recently, and am now acquainted with some of the finer points of the state laws. Parents/legal guardians can buy a drink and give it to their children, but the server cannot give the drink directly to the minor nor be paid by the minor. anyone else but the parent/legal guardian, say a grandfather, cannot buy his grandchild a drink. People can become licensed bartenders (or store clerks, grocery checkout attendants, etc) at the age of 18, and serve drinks. If under the age of 18, as many high school waitresses are, one cannot prepare or pour the drinks or open them, but can at least carry them to the table. But at least my parents can still get me drunk, were I a minor.
A dim ray of light perhaps..
The nanny state at its best. If law enforcement can not force me to show id unless I am suspected of commiting a crime how can a 16 year old cashier demand I show id when I am decades away from 21?
Fight back – speak up – speak out and do it often.
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